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Topic Title: AMD64 and WindowsXP SP2 problems
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Created On: 08/25/2004 01:14 PM
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 08/25/2004 01:14 PM
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zuel
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Hello!

I have updated one of my computers running AMD 1.2G wiith no problems. Running windowsxp w/sp2 update.
My newest computer is running the AMD64 w/Asus k8v se deluxe motherboard. The sp-2 patch installes okay but when it boots up it gets to the "windows is starting up" and reboots with no errors. This keeps going. My question: Should there be a problem updating to SP2 or is it something else in my computer?
I would like to know if I need to just do a new install of windows , sp1 and sp2.

Thanks,

Thomas Edwards
 08/25/2004 01:25 PM
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Ivan Andreevich
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You might wanna do a clean install, maybe? SP2 isn't perfect, you know. I doubt it's your computer's fault if it was working flawlessly before.
 08/25/2004 01:54 PM
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pointreyes
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Lucky you. At least your system reboots constantly-mine doesn't and so far I have found nothing to help me out. But in the process I did find this: http://support.microsoft.com/d...spx?...kb;en-us;878474' ">http://support.microsoft.com/d...x?scid=kb;en-us;878474
Might be useful for you.

-------------------------
Diagram of Hardware Profile' ">http://members.dsl-only.net/~pointreyes/ga/hsystem.jpg

BSD Daemon Copyright 1988 by Marshall Kirk McKusick. All Rights Reserved.
 08/25/2004 07:17 PM
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snugnads
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Thomas, If you can start-up in 'Safe' mode. Then go to the control panel, then add/remove programs and un-install SP2. Some people have had issues with SP2 and AMD64 (myself included). I don't think SP2 is ready for prime-time. Microsoft is going to unlease SP2 to the world via auto-update on Aug 25th. That should prove to be interesting.
 08/25/2004 07:18 PM
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snugnads
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and.....I guess it is the 25th already, but I don't use auto-update, so I don't know if SP2 is active now on auto-update.
 08/26/2004 02:32 AM
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mfiore
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It is a known isuue that certain programs in combination of the Athlon 64 and the new DEP module casues the system to blue screen and die.

1) You can use msconfig to turn everything off in Safe Mode and try re-starting the prorams one at a time. The offending program is likely a firewall or anit-virus prog.

2) Turn off DEP by following the instuctions availabe from Microsoft.

3) Un-install SP2 and wait until you programs have been updated.

Personally, since DEP will only catch a limited number of specific type of viruses, I choose option 2 and run a good firewall and anti-virus such as EZ-armor from Computer Associates. A free trial is available.

-------------------------
Giga-byte GA-K8NS Pro +
Athlon 64 2800 +
1Gb Mushkin PC3200 RAM
=Happy Camper!
 08/26/2004 05:52 PM
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marausch
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FYI:

Installed SP2 last night.

FLAWLESS VICTORY!

Plays very well with newest versions of McAfee (updated immediately before installing SP2).

During install, SP2 gave me the option to use SP2 FW or to specify my own (i.e., McAfee). I chose to stay with McAfee. While SP2 FW is a big step up from SP1, it's still way behind the industry leading SW FW programs.

So, now I'm running with SP2 DEP (NX) enabled, FW & Pop-Up blocker disabled (using McAfee for these functions).

So far all SW appears to be running as expected, including games.

-------------------------
"Faster, faster, faster, until the thrill of speed overcomes the fear of death!"

Hammerhead

Gigabyte K8VNXP (BIOS F10), Clawhammer F4 3200+ (OC=210x10)
2 x 120GB Seagate SATA RAID-1
ATI Radeon X800,
Ultra 512MB PC3200 DDR400 (x2) (2.7v)
Plextor 708A DVD +R, Plextor 716 DL DVD
Antec 400W ATX PSU, Planar 19" FP moni
MS Wireless KB, Logitech MX510 Mouse
Logitech Extreme 3D Pro Joystick
XP Pro OS, SP2
 08/27/2004 02:43 PM
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amaxware
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Two fold question:
Can you turn off the DEP mod BEFORE loading SP2?

Does SP2 automatically turn this on and therefore bluescreen?

 08/27/2004 02:54 PM
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marausch
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My experience was that I had no option or opportunity to turn NX (DEP) off during install and the option doesn't exist before install.

However, most of what I have read implicates various firewalls in the BSOD scenarios. Check the M$ compatibility list and disable/uninstall any firewall that isn't supported BEFORE you install SP2.

Also, make sure all AV/FW/PUB (pop-up blocker) sw is updated to lastest or disabled prior to install.

Both DEP and PUB were default enabled during install. FW will also be enable on install if SP2 doesn't recognize your FW. If you end up with 2 FW competing, you are likely to have problems during reboot.

-------------------------
"Faster, faster, faster, until the thrill of speed overcomes the fear of death!"

Hammerhead

Gigabyte K8VNXP (BIOS F10), Clawhammer F4 3200+ (OC=210x10)
2 x 120GB Seagate SATA RAID-1
ATI Radeon X800,
Ultra 512MB PC3200 DDR400 (x2) (2.7v)
Plextor 708A DVD +R, Plextor 716 DL DVD
Antec 400W ATX PSU, Planar 19" FP moni
MS Wireless KB, Logitech MX510 Mouse
Logitech Extreme 3D Pro Joystick
XP Pro OS, SP2
 08/28/2004 09:08 AM
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SouthernComfort
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Hello all ,

I just heard about this flaw in SP2 the other day , However I downloaded the full SP2 Self-Extracting Cabinet (266mb) because I like to have all Service packs on disk JIC of a needed reinstall.
So I have had SP2 running since 8/10 when downloaded. I don't trust auto update!!

I also have Norton Internet Security Pro 2004 and the current system has been up and running with little problems since first installed approx. May , 04.

However I don't want to run into this messy problem , is there any more info on this? and are there any known specific programs to avoid?

I have searched my PC (including Services) for DEP? but turned up nothing...is this strange? And I saw in the article that AMD 64 users should NOT install SP2......but I have allready done this...BUT I'm not having any problems .

This is the first place that came to mind when I read this disturbing news , and I hope that AMD and MS can work this out , However in the meantime should I uninstall SP2?

I hate situations like this maybe the next time Mr Gates donates a billion dollers to a charity he should donate it to his R&D/SP testing department. (JK ofcourse , his charity is actually very generous and much needed)

-------------------------
ASUS M4N82 Deluxe BIOS1008 ; AMD Phenom II 965 BE with a HUGE ASUS cooler @stock ; EVGA GTX280 / XFX 9600GT PhysX ; 4gig (2x2) OCZ Reaper 1066 ; ASUS Xonar D2 ; 3 HDD's SATA 3.0gbs WD ; ; PC Power&Cooling 860 Turbo Cool ESA ; Win 7 pro 64 bit ;ASUS My Cinema-EHD3-100 PCI-e TV card
 08/28/2004 02:00 PM
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marausch
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DEP is found in the Systems Properties (Control Panel / System / Advanced Tab / Performance Settings / Data Execution Prevention)

BTW, my wife's Vaio doesn't support HW DEP so a message to that effect appears in her window but not in mine.

-------------------------
"Faster, faster, faster, until the thrill of speed overcomes the fear of death!"

Hammerhead

Gigabyte K8VNXP (BIOS F10), Clawhammer F4 3200+ (OC=210x10)
2 x 120GB Seagate SATA RAID-1
ATI Radeon X800,
Ultra 512MB PC3200 DDR400 (x2) (2.7v)
Plextor 708A DVD +R, Plextor 716 DL DVD
Antec 400W ATX PSU, Planar 19" FP moni
MS Wireless KB, Logitech MX510 Mouse
Logitech Extreme 3D Pro Joystick
XP Pro OS, SP2
 08/28/2004 03:11 PM
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jbond93
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Ok, so what do you do if your computer doesn't even go into safe mode? I have seen several replies on other boards where people can't even get into safe mode. The link to the microsoft fixed can only be done in safe mode? My computer boots up and hangs on the windows screen and then reboots after 1-2 minutes over and over, and if you select safe mode it hangs and reboots.

Previous know good also reboots and hangs, reboots and hangs..............any help would be great.............I am dead in the water.

Thanks



-------------------------
AMD64 Athlon +3200
1.2G of Quality RAM
MSI K8T Neo FIS2R
Maxtor Diamond 9 120GB SATA
Seagate Barr. 160GB IDE 8mb buf.
ATI Radeon Pro 128 MB
On-Board Sound
Iomega Zip CD Burner
Antec 430w True Power
 08/28/2004 10:35 PM
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SouthernComfort
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Hello marausch , thank you for your help.

QUOTE DEP is found in the Systems Properties (Control Panel / System / Advanced Tab / Performance Settings / Data Execution Prevention)



Yep I found it , but it is set to Turn on only for essential windows programs (the top button) but I still have had no problem.

You know After I installed SP2 Norton asked my if I wanted it to be my main Virus protection Program and it gave 2 options: Yes (recomended) and No , I selected Yes because I had no idea that XP even had Virus protection , but its funny that all these months Norton NEVER asked me this before...untill I installed SP2.

Well I backed everything up on DVD JIC SP2 decides to go berserk on me , but untill then I'm keeping it installed , its been nearly a month now and I do everything from Video capture home movies and convert to DVD to All kinds of games to watching TV and DVDs while surfing the web.

Keeping my fingers crossed and wishing luck to everyone having Problems with SP2 and AMD 64's.

Southern



-------------------------
ASUS M4N82 Deluxe BIOS1008 ; AMD Phenom II 965 BE with a HUGE ASUS cooler @stock ; EVGA GTX280 / XFX 9600GT PhysX ; 4gig (2x2) OCZ Reaper 1066 ; ASUS Xonar D2 ; 3 HDD's SATA 3.0gbs WD ; ; PC Power&Cooling 860 Turbo Cool ESA ; Win 7 pro 64 bit ;ASUS My Cinema-EHD3-100 PCI-e TV card
 08/29/2004 12:25 PM
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TheNOob
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my question is this: does it worth downloading it? because i down't want to download it and start having problem with it.
 08/30/2004 11:51 AM
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SouthernComfort
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I found a work-around for the reboot problem , but you MUST get into safe mode at the very least for it to work!

First off let me say that after nearly a month I ran into this DEP problem today!!!

It seems that DEP doesn't like LARGE video files or LARGE picture files.

Anyways I do NOT have Reboot on Error turned on , this is why DEP just kept shutting off and restarting Windows Explorer........LOL!! SP2 doesn't like WINDOWS EXPLORER!!! LOL!!! AND I needed to make a VERY large Picture file and burn a slideshow TODAY!!

So I did a search and it seems that you can STOP DEP from shutting down offending programs one at a time.

AND IT WORKED!!! I added Windows Explorer to the do not shut down list and BAM!! All is well again.

If your interested in a temp workaround till they patch....their....patch here is how:

First get into safe mode or IF YOU CAN Boot to desktop , then do this:

Turn off Boot on Error' ">http://home.earthlink.net/~lre.../ContPanl/REBOOTOF.HTM

you may have to restart , but if/when you do go into Safe again or all the way IF YOU CAN into XP and do this:

Turn off DEP for offending programs/program' ">http://www.tech-recipes.com/windows_tips566.html

It showed Explorer on mine when I did it , so I checked the box and no more reboot!!


I hope this helps someone , this is a SOB of a problem!!

good luck!

-------------------------
ASUS M4N82 Deluxe BIOS1008 ; AMD Phenom II 965 BE with a HUGE ASUS cooler @stock ; EVGA GTX280 / XFX 9600GT PhysX ; 4gig (2x2) OCZ Reaper 1066 ; ASUS Xonar D2 ; 3 HDD's SATA 3.0gbs WD ; ; PC Power&Cooling 860 Turbo Cool ESA ; Win 7 pro 64 bit ;ASUS My Cinema-EHD3-100 PCI-e TV card
 08/30/2004 10:51 PM
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jbond93
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I am back up and running without SP2. As mentioned I didn't even have the option of safe mode after the SP2 install. It just would start up get to the windows Xp screen (with the progress bar) and then reboot. If I did an F8 and tried safe mode it would start to load and then hang at mup.sys and reboot.

I tried everything posted everywhere. I even tried to use the recovery console but it did not recognize my SATA hard drive. I even tried to do a windows install and it said that windows could not write to the drive.

So off to Best Buy and I bought another hard drive only IDE this time and did a clean windows install. Once up and running I tried to hook the SATA hard drive up as a second drive and the computer would not boot. I unplugged the drive and it would boot fine.

I then disabled the SATA controller and connected the drive again. The computer booted fine and in windows I enabled the SATA controller. It said it was working properly but I still counld not see the drive.

I then loaded the Maxtor MaxBlast hard-drive setup software on the computer and it performed a "search and initialization " for new hard drives. It found and before going to the next step (which was formatting) I backed out of the program and suddenly could read everything from the drive.

I then shut down and plugged the SATA drive in as the primary and oddly enough it still will not boot off of it, however as a second drive I can read everything ( thank goodness).

Sorry for rambling but I hope someone from AMD will read this as this is not typical of the problems most have had with SP2 but I have seen others posting else where that cannot get into safe mode as well.

Ultimatly something in SP2 caused the boot file on my SATA drive to become corrupt. I saw other posts stating that people removed the SATA drive and put it into another computer to get their going again when they could not get into safe mode.

Good luck all, I am sitting this one out for a couple more months.

AMD64 Athlon +3200
1.2G of Quality RAM
MSI K8T Neo FIS2R (Latest Bio)
Maxtor Diamond 9 120GB SATA
Seagate Barr. 160GB IDE (new for the re-install)
ATI Radeon Pro 128 MB
On-Board Sound
Iomega Zip CD Burner


-------------------------
AMD64 Athlon +3200
1.2G of Quality RAM
MSI K8T Neo FIS2R
Maxtor Diamond 9 120GB SATA
Seagate Barr. 160GB IDE 8mb buf.
ATI Radeon Pro 128 MB
On-Board Sound
Iomega Zip CD Burner
Antec 430w True Power
 09/01/2004 12:40 PM
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snugnads
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Here's AMD's response I received via email regarding AMD64 & SP2.....



We are not experiencing any difficulties with the Athlon 64 processor
and Windows XP SP2.

I did respond by pointing out this article....

http://news.com.com/Microsoft%...s%20...bj=news.1016.20' ">http://news.com.com/Microsoft%...6707&subj=news.1016.20

but, I don't expect a response.....case closed!
 09/01/2004 06:26 PM
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snugnads
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Actually, I did get a response (a very quick one at that)......

Thank you for contacting AMD's Technical Service Center.

As I stated, there is no difficulties from a hardware perspective. All
of the conflicts arising are driver related (Mpegport.sys, etc). These
drivers were written in such a way that they conflict with Microsoft's
implementation of DEP. We also tested SP2 with our processors prior to
its release and found no conflicts. Somewhere between the beta build
we have of SP2 and final release, new issues have risen.

These problems are associated with AMD because we are the only ones at
the moment that have Enhanced Virus Protection. When Intel comes out
with their next round, they will also have something like EVP
(actually, exactly the same thing just with a different name). Windows
XP SP2 will have the same problems with those processors as well.

Unfortunately, we are paying the price for being an industry leader in
this area. SP2 has more problems than just the DEP, yet this is what
people are focusing on.

As for your resolution, unfortunately, it will probably be best to hold
off on SP2 until Microsoft resolves these issues.

Hope this helps. If you have any other questions, please feel free to
contact me.

Regards,
Jim
CPU Specialist
AMD TSC
 10/19/2004 04:31 AM
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HotShoT
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QUOTE (zuel @ Aug 25 2004, 09:14 AM)Hello!

I have updated one of my computers running AMD 1.2G wiith no problems. Running windowsxp w/sp2 update.
My newest computer is running the AMD64 w/Asus k8v se deluxe motherboard. The sp-2 patch installes okay but when it boots up it gets to the "windows is starting up" and reboots with no errors. This keeps going. My question: Should there be a problem updating to SP2 or is it something else in my computer?
I would like to know if I need to just do a new install of windows , sp1 and sp2.

Thanks,

Thomas Edwards
Hi Thomas,

This is my first post, and honestly haven't read all articles regarding your problem yet, but I truly hope that you've already found a solution to this problem.
I've always had AMDs and experienced very positive improvements running SP2, especially system speed. Except now.
The thing is, I've also got the ASUS K8V SE Deluxe with an AMD 64-bit 3400+ Processor recently. Everysince that... I only get a blue screen when booting (after the update to SP2). Of course I have made a clean install. I can, however, boot in Safe-Mode, but can't find any reason for the problem then either. Safe-Mode with Network does work as well.
I've already tried to set the bootup-configuration to Diagnostics (via MSCONFIG) to boot only with minimal requiered components, but... same blue screen.

Right now I'm back to SP1, but surely would like to run SP2, due to my positive experiences in the past.

Kindly inform me if you've found a solution to this problem.

Thanks!



Ps: I'm not sure if I wanna try running offending applications mentioned in "TheNOob's suggestion Posted on Aug 29 2004, 08:25 AM"?!

If you don't have a solution yet, I'll inform you as soon as I've found a solution.

-------------------------
----------------------------------------------------
===> Long live AMD-POWER!!! <===
----------------------------------------------------
AMD64 Athlon 3400+
ASUS K8V SE Deluxe
1.5GB Ram
1x 160GB SATA
1x 160GB IDE, 1x 120GB IDE, 1x 80GB IDE
LiteOn DVD-RW, LiteOn CD-RW
----------------------------------------------------
(The rest doesn't really matter now, does it?!)
----------------------------------------------------
 10/19/2004 04:53 AM
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Plater
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Zuel : I have the same motherboard you have. I had to go into safe mode and removed Service Pack 2 in the Add/Remove option.

Missile Maker had some good pointers on how to install service pack 2.

Look for the post SP2 in this forum, look under Missle Maker reply.
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