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Topic Title: X2 vs. Opteron 939
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Created On: 11/05/2005 03:57 PM
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 11/19/2005 11:35 PM
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TheReturnOfAZ
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QUOTE(atomicFan @ Nov 5 2005, 02:57 PM)Ok so I have been discussing this topic with some people for a while now and there seems to be great confusion over the differences of the two processors.

Let us use an example: 2 IDENTICAL 939 systems with a X2 and opteron that are clocked IDENTICALLY and have IDENTICAL amounts of cache.

Which one will perform better?

Someone seems to think the following:
He claims the a64 doesn't have these same identical optimizations.
Which means the the a64 has the optimizations but the opteron doesn't.
So again, given my example above with 100% otherwise identical systems does his statement hold any truth?
Now from my understanding the opteron is just tested more rigorously.  I have also heard (from unreliable sources) that the opteron uses better silicon.  Even if both of these were true is there ANY shred of evidence that the a64 is specifically tweaked for gaming while the opteron doesn't have those optimizations but is optimized for FP?  I can understand the first two things I touched on simply because a company would gladly pay for better reliability, isn't this the whole point of opteron?

I know other things differ between them such as non-coherent links.  But on a basic core level here is the opteron the same as an a64?
[right][snapback]539141[/snapback][/right]

other than voltage requirements and temperatures,
THEY
ARE
THE
EXACT
SAME
THING
ive owned both. a 4400+ and a 165. opterons run cooler. performance is exactly the same.

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 11/21/2005 08:11 PM
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ninjastyle
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QUOTE(1R4dD4d @ Nov 19 2005, 09:26 PM)I also am in the market for a dual core AMD processor, for my Home Theatre, Multi-Media PC, I recently built. My system is currently a AMD 64 3000+ running at HTT4 250 fsb, 2x 512Mb Corsair Pro pc 3200 LL ram, (Timings 2.5-3-3-7. 1T command rate), on an MSI K8N Neo 4 Plat SLI board, Latest Bios, I am mainly wanting to know the differences between the X2 series & the opteron 170 & if the differences in FSB make a difference i.e. X2 64=2000 FSB while Opteron 170=1000 is there a performance difference or is it the same fsb just listed different? Also does the Opteron 170 also support SSE3 & the No Execute extensions as well?

Thanks in Advance=)
[right][snapback]549802[/snapback][/right]


It's the same "FSB" for both. Socket 939 = 2000. Socket 754 = 1600. There is no "FSB", though, it's HTT (HyperTransport™ Technology).

And yes, the Opteron 170 supports SSE3 and No Execute. /smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /> The exact specs would be

Core: "Denmark" (90nm)
Stepping: E6
Clock freq: 2000MHz
HTT: 1000 (double it!
Socket: 939

Cache:
2x 64KB L1
2x 1MB L2

MMX
SSE
SSE2
SSE3
64bit
NX-Bit
 11/21/2005 09:57 PM
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uniblab
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I'd just like to point out that AMD is really hurting themselves by having such a confusing product lineup(imo). Why should I have to read through mounds of whitepapers, etc to figure out which processor I want. And based on this thread, it sounds like there are discrepancies and/or dated info that will further obfuscate things. /mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif' />
 11/21/2005 10:23 PM
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TheReturnOfAZ
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because you care.

when billy goes to best buy he is going to pick the highest number. that is all that matters. when mr. bossman needs a processor for a server, he gets the highest rated opteron he can find.

when you only want to spend $XX and you throw in performance as a factor (! then things start to get confusing.

i think their model numbers should contain basic things like core, clock, and cache but that is just me

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 12/07/2005 02:37 PM
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gerhard
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Ok,

So I've been watching this topic with interest...

There are motherboard solutions that work well with more than one south bridge solution. Specifically, the nForce 4 AMD solutions like this really cool FoxConn motherboard I've got:

NFPIK8AA-8EKRS

<Click Here to see the specifications.>' ">http://www.foxconnchannel.com/...m?pName=NFPIK8AA-8EKRS

The bottom line is that this motherboard makes use of the Opteron's multiple Hyper Transport connections by installing 2 south bridges.

The NVIDIA nForce Pro 2200 and the nForce Pro 2050. This gives you two actually chipsets to support two full x16 PCIe video solutions...

8 SATA II ports, etc... etc...

...and THAT is a really good reason to have multiple HT connections.
 12/07/2005 07:02 PM
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zir_blazer
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In the case of that pair of Chipsets, only one of the Southbridges is connected with the Processor using an Uncoherent Hyper Transport Link and its that Southbridge the one that is connected with the other Southbridge. The Processor isn't directly connected with both.
 01/06/2006 08:43 AM
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Danish
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/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif' /> Well , I just like to know one thing :

If Opteron X2 and Athlon X2 is the same ; /blink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='blink.gif' /> /tongue.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tongue.gif' /> /ohmy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='ohmy.gif' />
then why the f... are they called different names ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Those who claim they are identical should rename
Opteron 165 into Athlon 3900+
Athlon 3800+ into Opteron 163
Opteron 170 into Athlon 4100+
Athlon 4200+ into Opteron 172

And so on , come on there are (probably company-secretive) differences ? /ph34r.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='ph34r.gif' />


But what ? If AMD doesn' t reveal this , we'll all buy Intel-products now ! /laugh.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='laugh.gif' /> /laugh.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='laugh.gif' /> /laugh.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='laugh.gif' />

NB : Though actually my Pentium M is better than most AMD's in gaming ... /cool.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='cool.gif' />
 01/06/2006 10:31 AM
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zeppelinrox
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http://www.xbitlabs.com/articl...ispl...pu-games_5.html' ">http://www.xbitlabs.com/articl...lay/28cpu-games_5.html
see that pretty Pentium Xtreme Edition 3.73 ghz getting SMOKED?

But still.. i think i will switch to a Pentium M because I love slower performance.

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 01/06/2006 11:01 AM
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Danish
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QUOTE(zeppelinrox @ Jan 6 2006, 05:31 PM)http://www.xbitlabs.com/articl...ispl...pu-games_5.html' ">http://www.xbitlabs.com/articl...lay/28cpu-games_5.html
see that pretty Pentium Xtreme Edition 3.73 ghz getting SMOKED?

But still.. i think i will switch to a Pentium M because I love slower performance.
[right][snapback]585996[/snapback][/right]
The Pentium4's is a dead end for Intel , it's actually Pentium M that now is being build as dual-core (Yonah)
which will compete with AMD from now on .

And regarding slow performance of Pentium M ... Well , if You take a look at 3Dmark2005 You'll notice Pentium M
reaches nearly 12000 with 7800GTX512 whereas Athlon X2 is BELOW 11200 in a NON-SLI (only 1 card allowed ! .

But I'm looking forward to receive my X2 4200+ and put it in my ASUS A8N32SLIdeluxe-board /cool.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='cool.gif' />/cool.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='cool.gif' />/cool.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='cool.gif' />
for making a lot of hard video-work etc. done much faster (and cooler) than any Pentium-edition , yet !
 01/06/2006 11:11 AM
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zeppelinrox
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hey maybe intel will be able to compete for a change

for the same money, you are better off with an Opteron 170
an Opteron 165 would even be a better choice than the X2 4200+

twice the L2 cache

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 01/07/2006 12:35 AM
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TheReturnOfAZ
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QUOTE(Danish @ Jan 6 2006, 08:43 AM)NB : Though actually my Pentium M is better than most AMD's in gaming ...  /cool.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='cool.gif' />
[right][snapback]585942[/snapback][/right]

yeah ok

but on the original topic, buy an opteron 165 or 170, an X2 is just a waste of money right now

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 01/08/2006 07:54 PM
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Bitey
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Its a bit strange that AMD sells its low end server/workstaion cpu's less than its consumer CPU's. Thats where all the confusions lies, You would think price wise the consumer stuff should be cheaper.

But anywayze, its a bargain for people in the know
 01/08/2006 09:54 PM
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TheReturnOfAZ
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it used to be more expensive
and still is for high end
they just made them cheap to jumpstart sales
which have been jumpstarted
hence the recently higher prices

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 03/22/2006 05:44 PM
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myxisbird
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I will start by saying I am a complete newbie to procs, I know probably what the next guy knows (which is looking at the numbers and thinking *that is bigger then that*) , So hello
I was on the verge of buying a X2 4400+ but then I stumbled across a forum saying get the Opteron ,it's better. So I started digging.
I saw this thread and it almost threw me over but I really want some clerification before moving on with this...
I mostly use my PC for gaming,other then that I'm a pretty normal user and until now I always thought the Opteron was AMD's "server" type CPU,suitable for running a data base ,but pretty poor when it comes to gaming...Now I don't know what to think. So bottom line - a A8NSLI-Deluxe with a x1900xt will be better for gaming with a Opteron 165 O/Ced as much as I could, or a X2 4400+ O/Ced as much as I could? (which is not much, I'll only get better cooling for the Opteron if it's really neccessary). Keep in mind I can get the Opteron for much cheaper (around 200$ less....)
 03/22/2006 05:56 PM
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zeppelinrox
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yeah you can get that Opteron 165 up 2.6 ghz will little effort.
be sure to get decent ram. the gskill black ddr500 are a real good value

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 03/22/2006 07:02 PM
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aznsexienerd007
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ok, i've been reading mulitple topic relating to comparison between the Opteron and the X2 ... All they now left me a bit of confustion.

Let's me make sure i am up to date with things.

They are EXACTLY the same. The only different is the Opteron was test and proved to be higher stability and reliabilty and also CHEAPER.

For system set-up. The Opteron required buffered and registered ram (which is slower) to work therefore making the Opteron slower in bench test but make ABSOLUTELY no different for regular uses and gaming (Under the condition of non-overclocking -- hope i got that right).

For me:
I am thinking of making a new system that is simply for playing game and some normal use functions. I am not doing any hardcore gaming or graphic rendering at all, but i do want a stable/reliable system that move when i click my mouse and something to brag about. So which would you recommend, Opteron system vs. X2 system?

Thanks a bunch
 03/22/2006 07:15 PM
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zeppelinrox
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the socket 939 Opterons use the same unbuffered/unregistered ram as the X2s

if overclocking get an Opteron. If not overclocking, get an X2

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 03/22/2006 08:06 PM
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ilya_n75
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Hmm, I am tihnking of buying Opteron too after this discussion here, but are dual-core Opterons good overlockers, do they exist for socket 939? if they do can u suggest me the most oveclockable model? I heard Opteron 165 is good deal?
 03/22/2006 08:14 PM
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EduardoS
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I still want know the diference...
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Proce...oduc...ml?redir=CPOS14
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Proce...oduc...8^10756,00.html

Why the 1xx is listed with 3 HT links? And why 3?
And another strange thing...
L2 associativity (data/instruction)
4-way /
4-way 4-way /
4-way 4-way
/ 4-way

The L2 of K-8 wasn't 16 way associativy? And why (data/instruction) in L2?
 03/22/2006 08:37 PM
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zeppelinrox
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quote:

Originally posted by: ilya_n75
Hmm, I am tihnking of buying Opteron too after this discussion here, but are dual-core Opterons good overlockers, do they exist for socket 939? if they do can u suggest me the most oveclockable model? I heard Opteron 165 is good deal?


yes the socket 939 opterons overclock very well. generally the top out at about 2.7 ghz.
so I would suggest the Opteron 165 or if you can afford it, the Opteron 170.
They would top out about the same but the 170 would just be easier to overclock

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Overclocking Help and Links . Why DRM, BluRay and HD-DVD Blow Great tools-> OC Bible v1.52 and Guidemania v1.2
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