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Topic Title: +12V reading?TYAN Tiger K8W Dual Opteron S28
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Created On: 06/26/2005 12:13 PM
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 06/26/2005 12:13 PM
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Siddu
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Joined: 06/22/2005

I have had issues with the Nvidia 6600GT and ATI9800Pro locking up my system and auto rebooting in all 3d games and 3d apps. For 1 week all i have been doing is trying to diagnose issues with no results. I have also read the major threads out here related to this problem.However i am a complete idiot as to what voltages are required and how to read them so i thought i would post my readings here for you folks to decide if it is indeed a higher wattage PSU that i require.

My specs:
Dual proc AMD Opteron 248
TYAN Tiger K8W Dual AMD Opteron, S2875
2 gigs RAM
120 GB SATA
200GB SATA
460W Zippy PSU ( 32A on the +12V rail)
MSI 6600GT /ATI Radeon 9800Pro




Also i am not getting a +12V line reading in BIOS? Using rev 3.0 from AMD for this board and BIOS isnt showing anything related to +12v. Could there be a problem?
Are my voltages enough for powering any AGP card that requires a seperate power connector? My old vga cards such as the GeForce 4600 runs fine (it doesnt require a seperate +12v connection)
So far i have tried 2 PSU's...The Zippy 460W and the Antec True Power 480W. Do i need more power to drive these video cards? So far both cards are locking up in all 3d apps. Thought i might need more+ juice.Please advice.Thank you.
 06/27/2005 02:41 AM
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arcangel
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32A on the +12V rail looks fine enough. but i wonder if it truely delivers them. i really recommend you to buy a new PSU which has atleast 550W and preferably with 6 pin connector for your graphic card. All these readings from tyan monitor and speedfan doesnt tell us anythings related to this issue. they all show the Volts not the Amps which is the major issue here.... moreover i dont think there is a problem of 12V not being shown in the bios as u can see them in TSM....
one more things speed fan does show a poor +12V. i think its time to change ur PSU fast.....

-------------------------
Dual opteron 246
Tyan Thunder K8WE SCSI
Corsair, Seagate, Antec, Samsung, Sparkle.
 06/27/2005 01:37 PM
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bung-foo
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Joined: 06/28/2004

Test it with a second power supply if you can. Also, tyan publishes a list of powersupplies on thier site that are "supported" and known to work with a given product. Check that out if you are going to buy a new one.

-------------------------
Tyan Thunder K8WE
2xOpteron 246 (cO and cG steppings)
BFGTech 7800GT oc
Creative X-Fi Extreme Music
2 Gig Kingston DDR 3200
Western Digital Raptor 36 GB
 06/28/2005 05:05 PM
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derGhostrider
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QUOTE(arcangel @ Jun 27 2005, 08:41 AM)32A on the +12V rail looks fine enough. but i wonder if it truely delivers them. i really recommend you to buy a new PSU which has atleast 550W and preferably with 6 pin connector for your graphic card. All these readings from tyan monitor and speedfan doesnt tell us anythings related to this issue. they all show the Volts not the Amps which is the major issue here.... moreover i dont think there is a problem of 12V not being shown in the bios as u can see them in TSM....
one more things speed fan does show a poor +12V. i think its time to change ur PSU fast.....
[right][snapback]446398[/snapback][/right]

Agreed. A 12V line that just has an output of 10.xV is too weak. This could be an indicator for an overload on the 12V line.

Maybe it is not that clear in the posting of arcangel: Don't mix up an 6-pin 12V PCI-Express connector and the 6-pin SSI connector for the mainboard. For your AGP cards you do not need the PCI-Express connectors and must not connect this one to the mainboard. Well, you don't even need the 6-pin SSI connector for the board because it should just give power to the additional pins of the AGP-PRO socket - but the grafic cards are no AGP-Pro cards. They don't even populate the part of the AGP-Slot that is for AGP-PRO cards.
Nevertheless the 6pin mainboard plug can't harm your system if connected. I have the 6pin plug connected as well on my Thunder K8W S2885 (and don't need it for my X800Pro).

-------------------------
Regards,
  Ghostrider

·CPUs - 2*Opteron 246
·Mainboard - Tyan Thunder K8W S2885ANRF
·RAM - 4*Corsair TwinX1024RE-3200LL (4GB, 8*512MB, DDR400, 2-3-2)
·Graphics - HIS IceQ-II X800Pro
·HDD - Western Digital Raptor WD740GD, 74GB, 10k
·RAID - 3Ware 7850, 64bit PCI, 8chn hardware RAID
·RAID-HDDs - 5*WD800JB
·Optical - 1*SlimSize CD-ROM; 1*NEC7441 DVD-RW
·Sound - Creative SoundBlaster X-Fi Elite Pro

 06/28/2005 05:43 PM
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MrSeanKon
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Joined: 05/23/2005

If you don't measure voltages with a multimeter all are nothing.
Follow my link. /smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />
LOL CPUz shows Vcore=1.692-1.712 and changes rapidly..
MBM shows anything too...
Multimeter shows 1.744 rock stable at full load. /wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />

-------------------------
Grab here OcBible v1.54 and Guidemania v1.2!
 06/30/2005 06:02 AM
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derGhostrider
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QUOTE(MrSeanKon @ Jun 28 2005, 11:43 PM)If you don't measure voltages with a multimeter all are nothing.
Follow my link. /smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />
LOL CPUz shows Vcore=1.692-1.712 and changes rapidly..
MBM shows anything too...
Multimeter shows 1.744 rock stable at full load. /wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />
[right][snapback]448010[/snapback][/right]


That does not mean anything. Maybe your multimeter is just "too slow" to measure the changing voltages or it takes the average over a period of time that is longer than the time of the fluctuations.

The build in probes are (in general) exact enough to detect the voltages properly. If they would vary too much it would be a known problem that the displayed values vary from the real values.
OK, I would not count that much on the second and third digits. But I am pretty sure that the difference between 10V and 12V can be detected pretty much - especially if the other values are displayed correct.
As long as there is no defect on the board the 12V line does not provide enough power. Or with other words: The devices in his system require that much power (high current) that the electric potential drops below 12V. That's a common behaviour under overload conditions.

And maybe you should check the manual of your multimeter how fast it can detect voltage fluctuations and if it is calibrated.
I know that good calibrated multimeters cost a lot of money. I myself just own a non-calibrated that is granted to measure with an accuracy between +-0.8% +1dgt and 2% +5dgts. In this case (12VDC) it would be able to reach an accuracy of 0.8% +1dgt. With a maximum of 2.5 measurements per second.

So the first digit after the decimal dot would already be "unsure". And you don't know what a calibrated multimeter would measure. Maybe you have a systematic failure of 0.2V without knowing it.
There are many parameters that have to be checked if you are going to take EXACT values.

I study physics and I know that the measurement of a value is not that easy - even if you think that simple multimeter could to the job.

E.g.: Take a simple digital thermometer that should display the temperature outside. Most of the devices you can buy for a few dollars even show digits after decimal point. Something like 24.3°C... That's nonsense. IF you have luck the real temperature does not vary more than 1° from the displayed temperature. The decimals behind the point do NOT have anything to do with the accuracy.
And if you really want to reach a great accuracy you need several measurements and have to do some calculations. Than you may be able to tell someone which value you measured and the true accuracy of the measurement. But don't use a simple multimeter for (maybe) about 20$ - 120$ and think that the values on the display are the REAL values.
Even the measurement itself changes the value of the voltage that you want to detect. That's a small effect but under special circumstances it gets very important.

etc... I think that there are many more effects that could cause a measurement to fail.

Just a 20% failure in a voltage detection of a mainboard that is used in its specifications (without volt-mods etc) is non-usual.

-------------------------
Regards,
  Ghostrider

·CPUs - 2*Opteron 246
·Mainboard - Tyan Thunder K8W S2885ANRF
·RAM - 4*Corsair TwinX1024RE-3200LL (4GB, 8*512MB, DDR400, 2-3-2)
·Graphics - HIS IceQ-II X800Pro
·HDD - Western Digital Raptor WD740GD, 74GB, 10k
·RAID - 3Ware 7850, 64bit PCI, 8chn hardware RAID
·RAID-HDDs - 5*WD800JB
·Optical - 1*SlimSize CD-ROM; 1*NEC7441 DVD-RW
·Sound - Creative SoundBlaster X-Fi Elite Pro

 06/30/2005 07:59 AM
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MrSeanKon
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Posts: 257
Joined: 05/23/2005

derGhostrider things are simple.
Expensive devices are not necessary for someone who spends 1000-2000 Euros for a PC we are not scientists.. /wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />
OK I read your post and I agree of course.
In the past when I was student we had Electrical measurements labs etc...
But a multimeter around 30 Euros is OK for most applications.
It is not necessary to buy an oscillator just for measurements. /smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

-------------------------
Grab here OcBible v1.54 and Guidemania v1.2!
 07/10/2005 01:20 AM
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unashamed
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Joined: 07/10/2005

Im having the very same problems, Ive already sent in my board to tyan for possible repairs but was notified that it was a bad bios chip. I purchased a 6600 gt to replace my 9800 and had my new card ready for when my board got back from being RMA'ed
Unfortuantely the machien still locks up in most if not all Direct 3d applications.

Some more support from Tyan/AMD on this would be greatly appreciated.
 07/12/2005 09:06 AM
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derGhostrider
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Joined: 04/04/2004

QUOTE(MrSeanKon @ Jun 30 2005, 01:59 PM)It is not necessary to buy an oscillator just for measurements. /smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />
[right][snapback]449306[/snapback][/right]

That's true but then you can also believe in the onboard sensors that tend to do their job good enough.


So, if you get a 10V readout from a 12V line I'd say that the PSU has to be replaced!

-------------------------
Regards,
  Ghostrider

·CPUs - 2*Opteron 246
·Mainboard - Tyan Thunder K8W S2885ANRF
·RAM - 4*Corsair TwinX1024RE-3200LL (4GB, 8*512MB, DDR400, 2-3-2)
·Graphics - HIS IceQ-II X800Pro
·HDD - Western Digital Raptor WD740GD, 74GB, 10k
·RAID - 3Ware 7850, 64bit PCI, 8chn hardware RAID
·RAID-HDDs - 5*WD800JB
·Optical - 1*SlimSize CD-ROM; 1*NEC7441 DVD-RW
·Sound - Creative SoundBlaster X-Fi Elite Pro

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