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Topic Title: Asus K7m-rm w/ amd 750 T-Bird Model 4
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Created On: 08/06/2004 09:44 AM
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 08/06/2004 09:44 AM
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rogvalcox
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Learning new things every day, so please bear with me.

I have just upgraded my processor, on my asus k7-m-rm mobo, to a 750 T-bird model 4, and it just doesn't seem to be that much over the K7 550 it had in it. Everything is running fine, it just doesn't seem like that much of an improvement and I was under the understanding that the 750 was significanty faster because of the 256K on-board cache, etc. I do know however that I can overclock with this mobo. So I go onto the Bios and run it up to the max (150) save it and restart and on the post it flashes a warning that there has been an overclocking and to enter the setup and then it automaticly sets it back to default. Meanwhile I'm reading some forums about overclocking an i've discovered there is more to it such as changing the multiplier speeds etc. However I can't find enough information here and there and everywhere else to put all the pieces of the puzzle together and fill in the gaps enough that I can figure it out on my own.

If someone can take my hand (figuratively speaking ) through this process I would greatly appreciate it. Or atleast point me in the right direction.

Bye the way I did flash my bios and I downloaded msconfig for my win 2000 o/s and cleaned up my sytem tray a little and that helped the load in speed for windows a little bit.

( don't know what kind emotions I have right now!!
 08/06/2004 05:06 PM
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Charlie22911
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i think -milt- is the one to tell you that since ive seen some crazy overclocks from him.
i can tell you that as far as file system goes a faster hd drive is needed for that, you can have a 1Thz cpu and file system wont be faster.
download cpumark99 and put your old cpu in and run cpumark99, compare with your newer cpu to see the improvement. i will add a link to cpumark99 in my sig soon.

-------------------------
Desktop:
Phenom II x6 1055T @ 4GHz | 4x2GB Patriot DDR3 1600 @ 2000 | 3x AMD Radeon HD6970 Crossfire

Laptop:
Core i7 2960xm @ 4.2Ghz | 4x4GB Kingston DDR3 1866 | 2x GTX 580m SLI OC 725/1450/1500
 08/09/2004 10:38 AM
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rogvalcox
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Ok- Now don't laugh I am still learning!! LOL

I did the cpu-mark on both the 750 and the 550 and the 750 did 11.3 and the 550 did 11.6.

So that being done, first of all I would think the 750 should have been a little more than the 550 and if those numbers are even average for those processors? So seeing these results what would you recomend me to do next?

Thank You, all help is appreciated.
 08/09/2004 04:46 PM
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Charlie22911
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you should be getting WAY WAY higher, on my VERY out dated K6-2 500Mhz cpu scored a MAX of around 27, and have seen O'c K6-III+ like mine at 600Mhz, 450 stock reach a score of 53+ wich yours should smoke pretty easy. we need to get your standard cpus running at full before we can get them to preform well at O'c speeds, do you have a list of FSB speeds and multipliers you can use?

download sis sandra so we can run ram benchmarks on her to see if that is what is holding you back (wich is the case with me, my K6-III+ hitting a 20+ score and should be 50+ and ram speeds about 74Mb/s should be 150+Mb/s).

-------------------------
Desktop:
Phenom II x6 1055T @ 4GHz | 4x2GB Patriot DDR3 1600 @ 2000 | 3x AMD Radeon HD6970 Crossfire

Laptop:
Core i7 2960xm @ 4.2Ghz | 4x4GB Kingston DDR3 1866 | 2x GTX 580m SLI OC 725/1450/1500
 08/09/2004 06:16 PM
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rogvalcox
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Charlie I did what I think you wanted me to but it's been a long time and I can't figure out how to do a screenshot or whatever so I can post you the results here on the forum. Can you refresh my memory on that.
 08/09/2004 09:54 PM
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Charlie22911
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sure, download irfanview (search on google) and regester with a free acount at www.photobucket.com after you do a screen capture (should be in options if i rember) save it as a JPEG file and upload to photobucket.com copy & paste all the text from the "[img]" text box into your reply window:

the reason i sugest irfan view is because win98 doesnt support JPEG save formats resulting in a large filesize that photobucket will not take. what windows version do you have?

-------------------------
Desktop:
Phenom II x6 1055T @ 4GHz | 4x2GB Patriot DDR3 1600 @ 2000 | 3x AMD Radeon HD6970 Crossfire

Laptop:
Core i7 2960xm @ 4.2Ghz | 4x4GB Kingston DDR3 1866 | 2x GTX 580m SLI OC 725/1450/1500
 08/10/2004 07:31 AM
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rogvalcox
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ok I think this is what you wanted, i'm curious to see what this translates into!!




 08/10/2004 05:42 PM
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-Milt-
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Hi rogvalcox,

Okay, lookin' good so far... that memory bench, while not great, smokes Charlies.

Now, run WCPUID, (or CrystalCPUID,) to get all the pertinant details about what CPU you actually have in there, and what speed it's currently running at...
Make a note of the L2 cache, the multiplier, and the Family - Model - Stepping ID...
From that info, we can figure out exactly what it is you have, and what it should be running at.
WCPUID is available for free here http://www.h-oda.com/' ">http://www.h-oda.com/
CrystalCPUID is available free, from this page http://crystalmark.info/?lang=en' ">http://crystalmark.info/?lang=en

You should be getting MUCH better on CPUmark99, as Charlie says.... here's my K6-3+ 450 @ 600 MHz



-------------------------
Here is my new PCChips M848A' ">http://img.photobucket.com/alb...2_T-2-3-3-6-2_M848.jpg v2.1, with a 1700+ @ 2411 MHz, and my trusty old PCChips M810L' ">http://members.lycos.co.uk/mmm...00MHz_Sandra_tests.jpg v7.1A, with a Barton 2500+ @ over 3500+. Some of my fancy cars are on this pag
 08/10/2004 06:25 PM
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Charlie22911
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ram speeds are what may be holding you back here, by adjusting your memory timings in the bios we can probly get things going better, but those mem speeds are killing mine, nearly or more than 100Mb/s faster.
what videocard are you using on this, is it the onboard stuf?

-------------------------
Desktop:
Phenom II x6 1055T @ 4GHz | 4x2GB Patriot DDR3 1600 @ 2000 | 3x AMD Radeon HD6970 Crossfire

Laptop:
Core i7 2960xm @ 4.2Ghz | 4x4GB Kingston DDR3 1866 | 2x GTX 580m SLI OC 725/1450/1500
 08/10/2004 07:45 PM
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-Milt-
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rogvalcox,

I just noticed that in your first post you sayQUOTE I can overclock with this mobo. So I go onto the Bios and run it up to the max (150) save it and restart
This is NOT the way to 'overclock'!

You advance (read 'raise' the CPU's FSB a little-at-a-time, like from your current 100 to 105, reboot and run a little test (like CPUmark99), to see if it's reasonably stable at the higher speed.
If it is, go back into CMOS, raise it another 5 MHz, and repeat.
Keep doing that until you start getting errors, or Windows won't load (whichever comes first), then back it down a couple of MHz and repeat.

Try that, see how far up you can get, and report back.

-------------------------
Here is my new PCChips M848A' ">http://img.photobucket.com/alb...2_T-2-3-3-6-2_M848.jpg v2.1, with a 1700+ @ 2411 MHz, and my trusty old PCChips M810L' ">http://members.lycos.co.uk/mmm...00MHz_Sandra_tests.jpg v7.1A, with a Barton 2500+ @ over 3500+. Some of my fancy cars are on this pag
 08/10/2004 08:44 PM
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rogvalcox
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OK - Sorry MILT, Don't lose faith in me!! That's why i'm trying to learn this stuff. I do greatly appreciate the help!!

Here is the CPUID.

 08/10/2004 09:15 PM
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Charlie22911
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hmm tweaked memory timings anyone?
maybe that can help here.
what background programs are open when you run the test? better yet the run the tests in cpumark99 in safe mode, are you using onboard video, it will slow ram to a crawl in some cases so let us know.

-------------------------
Desktop:
Phenom II x6 1055T @ 4GHz | 4x2GB Patriot DDR3 1600 @ 2000 | 3x AMD Radeon HD6970 Crossfire

Laptop:
Core i7 2960xm @ 4.2Ghz | 4x4GB Kingston DDR3 1866 | 2x GTX 580m SLI OC 725/1450/1500
 08/10/2004 09:31 PM
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rogvalcox
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OK - I'm going to shut down and run my cpumark99 in safe mode. As far as programs in the background while testing, in the system tray i've got the pop-up blocker, sound volume, anti-virus & internet security, and my dsl connection. Other than that I didn't have anything else going on that I was aware of. I wasn't bouncing around between two or three apps at the same time.

In the meantime, I was hoping you guy's would kind of drop me a brief translation of what those two screenshot mean to you so I can kind of understand what is going through your heads as we go along?

I'll get back in a few mins.

Thank You All !!!! Kind of embarrased to display my ignorance but I guess you have to learn one way or another...huh!!
 08/10/2004 10:03 PM
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-Milt-
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rogvalcox,

Thanks for the screenshot... it helps.

I'll assume that because of the 5.5x multiplier, and the 512K of L2 cache running at half speed that it is of the 550 MHz CPU that you want to replace.
The 750 has the same 512K of L2 cache, but for some reason, on the 750 (and on any faster Slot 'A' CPUs than the the 750) the L2 runs at 0.4 of the CPU.
Source: http://www.cpuscorecard.com/cpuprices/ak7.htm' ">http://www.cpuscorecard.com/cpuprices/ak7.htm
And, the multiplier would be 7.5x on a 750... (doh!

Next step is to ask what options do you have in CMOS for changing the CPU's FSB from 100 up to what, 150 MHz?
If so, see my previous post, and start 'bumping up' the FSB in 5 MHz increments.
And also, do you have any option to change the multiplier, from the current 5.5x ?

Edit: P.S. the only 'dumb questions' around here are the ones that don't get asked, or ones that get asked twice in the same thread.

-------------------------
Here is my new PCChips M848A' ">http://img.photobucket.com/alb...2_T-2-3-3-6-2_M848.jpg v2.1, with a 1700+ @ 2411 MHz, and my trusty old PCChips M810L' ">http://members.lycos.co.uk/mmm...00MHz_Sandra_tests.jpg v7.1A, with a Barton 2500+ @ over 3500+. Some of my fancy cars are on this pag
 08/10/2004 10:52 PM
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rogvalcox
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Ok - just so we are on the same page, the stats that we are currently discussing are for the 550 cpu. I can't seem to find any thing in the bios for changing the mutiplier, the only thing I can find is the option to up the cpu clock 1 mhz at a time from 90 to 150. The default, ofcourse, is 100 mhz. I'm wondering if I don't know what I'm looking for as far as the multiplier goes, or if it is kind of blatently obvious to just run across it? I am going to shut down and try to up the cpu a couple of mhz's at a time and see what I come across. I will be back momentarily so feel free to post any suggestions, as I will be back to check out what your latest comments are. I will let you know what I come accross.

Thanks Again for the help!!
 08/10/2004 11:16 PM
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-Milt-
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If the multiplier is adjustable in CMOS then yes, it'll be blatantly obvious... just look for something on the same page as the CPU FSB that says "5.5"

For every 5 MHz that you are able to increase the CPU's FSB you will see a corresponding 5% increase in your CPUmark99 score.
LMK how close I am on that 'guesstimate'.

-------------------------
Here is my new PCChips M848A' ">http://img.photobucket.com/alb...2_T-2-3-3-6-2_M848.jpg v2.1, with a 1700+ @ 2411 MHz, and my trusty old PCChips M810L' ">http://members.lycos.co.uk/mmm...00MHz_Sandra_tests.jpg v7.1A, with a Barton 2500+ @ over 3500+. Some of my fancy cars are on this pag
 08/10/2004 11:21 PM
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rogvalcox
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Well i'm back and I got the cpu up to 116 and it is running faster. Here is the new CPUMARK99 - 59.9. Tell me what you think. Should I leave alone or do you think I can do some more tweaking in other areas to get even more performance? Correct me if I'm wrong, but i'm thinking I can do the same thing with the 750 and get an even better porformance increase?

I also noticed that on POST it says I have a 650 CPU?

 08/10/2004 11:37 PM
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rogvalcox
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Here is the new screen shot on the 550, what do you think? Should I do the same process with the 750 and see what comes of it? And i'm assuming that not all CMOS have an adjustable multiplier?


 08/10/2004 11:41 PM
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-Milt-
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Yes, you can expect about the same possible increase in performance (percentage-wise) with the 750 as you've just achieved with the 550

The reason that it POSTs as a 650 is because you are now running at 5.5x 116 = 638 MHz and the BIOS 'rounds it up' to the nearest CPU that it knows about... in this case a 650 MHz CPU

And, there's more available, as Charlie suggests, several posts above...

-------------------------
Here is my new PCChips M848A' ">http://img.photobucket.com/alb...2_T-2-3-3-6-2_M848.jpg v2.1, with a 1700+ @ 2411 MHz, and my trusty old PCChips M810L' ">http://members.lycos.co.uk/mmm...00MHz_Sandra_tests.jpg v7.1A, with a Barton 2500+ @ over 3500+. Some of my fancy cars are on this pag
 08/10/2004 11:47 PM
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rogvalcox
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What is Charlie talking about when he comments on memory tweaking? Where would one start with that?

I'm going to shut down and see what I can make of the 750 cpu, hopefully I will be back soon to post a result. Let me know if there is still more to come to improve performance other than overclocking!!

I'll Be Back!!
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