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Topic Title: slow 533Mhz K6-2 running Win XP
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Created On: 12/20/2005 10:30 PM
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 12/20/2005 10:30 PM
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ajrindy
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I was recently given a used computer by a friend who bought a new one. There was nothing wrong with it except is was old and had a lot of spyware on it. So I reformatted the drive and loaded Windows 2000 on it. That ran great, but I could not find any compatible video drivers for it. So I moved it from Windows 2000 to Windows XP Professional and it is very slow. I cannot figure this out.

The system is an older Compaq Presario 7470. It has 512mb RAM, 20gb hard drive, a 97Mhz system bus and the 533MHz AMD K6-2 processor with 3D NOW technology.

Any thoughts on how I can get this thing running at its potential again?

Thanks in advance for any help!!
 12/21/2005 03:23 AM
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candle_86
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QUOTE(ajrindy @ Dec 20 2005, 07:30 PM)I was recently given a used computer by a friend who bought a new one.  There was nothing wrong with it except is was old and had a lot of spyware on it.  So I reformatted the drive and loaded Windows 2000 on it.  That ran great, but I could not find any compatible video drivers for it.  So I moved it from Windows 2000 to Windows XP Professional and it is very slow.  I cannot figure this out.

The system is an older Compaq Presario 7470.  It has 512mb RAM, 20gb hard drive, a 97Mhz system bus and the 533MHz AMD K6-2 processor with 3D NOW technology. 

Any thoughts on how I can get this thing running at its potential again?

Thanks in advance for any help!!
[right][snapback]571013[/snapback][/right]

Yes find your vid card manufactuer, download the windows 2000 drivers to a CD and go back to windows 2000. Anyone will tell you XP needs at least 1ghz to run smooth, just like Me needs to be uninstalled and have 2000 installed over it.

-------------------------
Core I7-3930k -- MSI GTX670 Quad SLI -- ASUS Rampage Extreme IV -- 4x4gb Muskin Redline DDR3 1866 -- 128gb SSD -- Windows 7 Ultimate
Phenom II 960T -- XFX HD4870 -- ECS IC780M -- 2x2gb DDR3 1333 -- 500gb HD -- Windows 7 Home Premium
 12/21/2005 05:23 AM
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srg86
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QUOTE(candle_86 @ Dec 21 2005, 12:23 AM)Yes find your vid card manufactuer, download the windows 2000 drivers to a CD and go back to windows 2000. Anyone will tell you XP needs at least 1ghz to run smooth, just like Me needs to be uninstalled and have 2000 installed over it.
[right][snapback]571140[/snapback][/right]


I run XP on 512MB with large folding jobs and it's as smooth as anything.

My laptop has 256MB and it's fine.


-------------------------
AMD Athlon 64 X2 4200+ (Manchester) 2.2GHz, DFI LanParty UT nF4 Ultra-D, 1GB Corsair XMS DDR400 Dual Channel, 80GB WD Caviar SE SATA, 80GB Maxtor DiamondMax 9 SATA, NEC 4550A, Radeon X800GTO 128MB DDR, M-Audio Audiophile 2496, Tagan TG480-U01.

Commodore Amiga 1200, MC68060 50MHz CPU (FPU Built in), 2MB Chip RAM, 16MB Fast RAM, AGA Graphics Chipset, 20GB IBM Travelstar 40GN, Kickstart 3.1 ROM, Workbench 3.1
 12/21/2005 06:01 AM
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eddaweaver
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But do those systems have onboard video and no L2 cache? /smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /> /sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />

rindy: try Compaq's website, it is sure to tell you somewhere what video chip/card is in there.
 12/21/2005 07:14 AM
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KachiWachi
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Presario 7470 -> http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfr...duct...t=94486&dlc=en&' ">http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfr...&product=94486&dlc=en&

Graphics Trident Graphics Integrated in the ViaChipset.
Integrated 2X AGP 3D Graphics
Integrated 64-bit hardware-accelerated 3D graphics
MPEG full-motion video playback
Maximum non-interlaced resolution of up to 1600 x 1200 (when supported by monitor)

Three different driver updates in the Win98 area...Via/Trident/Camero...none in W2K or XP though.

-------------------------
KachiWachi

Moderator - Wim's BIOS

CPU #1 - DFI 586IPVG, K6-2/+ 450 (Cyrix MII 433), 128MB EDO. BIOS patched by Jan Steunebrink.
CPU #2 - Amptron PM-7900 (M520), i200 non-MMX, 128MB EDO
CPU #3 - HP8766C, PIII-667, 768MB SDRAM
CPU #4 - ASUS P3V4X, PIII-733, 256MB SDRAM
CPU #5 - ??? ;)
 12/21/2005 10:12 AM
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candle_86
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Ok now you know the brand of the 3-D chip, go to there site and download the drivers. Also when I said 1ghz I was meaning CPU not Ram, XP will run fine on a 256mb system. One thing I would suugest find a K-III if your system will run it, it has onboard L2 and will be a boost, and if you already have on board L2 on that system than your system L2 becomes L3 and you become faster. But unless your CPU is 1ghz + with 256mb of ram I would not advise XP operation. If you can't find drivers for your card at themanufactures site, try driverguide.com, they usally have what your looking for. One question, why not run 98, for that machine 98 would do wonders, and the programs that will only run under an NT envioroment wont run on yours even if its on the NT kernal. I would suggest going back to Windows 98SE and get all the updates for it, 98SE runs great if you take care of it, plus it would seem Compaq only supports 98SE on that system, and your friend might have the restore CD's for it anyway. Thats my 2 cents, but I would suggest running what that computer was designed to run, though avoid Me unless your really good with computers, because you have to love tweaking to make Me not crash.

-------------------------
Core I7-3930k -- MSI GTX670 Quad SLI -- ASUS Rampage Extreme IV -- 4x4gb Muskin Redline DDR3 1866 -- 128gb SSD -- Windows 7 Ultimate
Phenom II 960T -- XFX HD4870 -- ECS IC780M -- 2x2gb DDR3 1333 -- 500gb HD -- Windows 7 Home Premium
 01/31/2006 02:42 PM
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WarlordOne
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I just got a new laptop and a broadband internet connection for the house. After setting up the wireless router I decided to dust off the old (read:unused) Compaq Presario 5465 and set it up for internet browsing and such. After reformatting the 2 hard drives I installed Windows XP professional 2002 SP2 only to find the processor constantly pegged at 100%! After a little research I found this:

http://www.fixyourwindows.com/optimizewindows.htm

And after applying most of these tweaks my CPU usage went down to 20% with a PF usage of 97MB. I found my old nVidia GeForce2 installed it, updated the drivers, overclocked it, and disabled the onboard vid. My CPU usage hovers around 10% now and it's finally useable. This is what I have:

Compaq Presario 5465 running:
Windows XP Professional
Ver. 2002 SP2
AMD-K6-2 3D processor
475MHz, 316MB RAM
nVidia GeForce2 MX/MX 400

Hope this helps...
 01/31/2006 04:16 PM
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Suzueya
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I am running XP on my AT machine, (K6-3+ 450ACZ OCed @ 6x100 - and before that w/ a K6-2 550 AGR @ 5.5x100) and that seems to run fine for me w/ 512 Meg of RAM. I suppose to some extent it depends on what your expectations are; but if you ask me, "Warlord One" is on the right track. For what it is worth, you can also very easily OC that processor by stepping the voltage up to 2.3v and changing the FSB to 100 Mhz. The gain is only 17 Mhz; but because it is derived by increasing the FSB the result is somewhat dispropotionate.

Note: According to persons more knowledgeable than myself, (to give credit where credit is due, they were Monaro 327 & Gardner @ K6Plus), all K6-2 processors w/ the same three letter designation were designed and manufactured to the same specification irrespective of what it says on top of the heat spreader cap. The same individuals informed me that for this reason, some people made it a practice to buy the lowest speed rated processor, (cheapest), available within a given "Three Letter Designation" group, then OC it up to the speed of the highest speed rated processor within that same group. To do that, however, you also have to change the voltage to that recommended for the faster processor; which in the case of the K6-2 550 AGR was 2.3v.
 02/02/2006 01:44 AM
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WarlordOne
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Well, you've convinced me. Because i'm interesting in getting the most out of this tired old PC I decided to OC the processor too. Not quite as easy as unlocking the additional features in my nVidia vid card but not difficult either. After adding additional case cooling and doing my reasearch I upped the FSB by using alternate switch settings on my MB. I increased my 475MHz machine to 500MHz by switching from 95 to 100MHz FSB. No voltage changes were nessicary as both 475 + 500 MHz AMD's run on 2.2v. Unfortunately the multiplier was maxed out a 5x so 500MHz and 5% increase are it.
 02/02/2006 04:19 AM
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WarlordOne
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Ok, I guess I'm a liar...I found the manufacturer of my Compaqs MB -Gigabit. They were nice enough on thier website to list all the processor switch settings in a PDF file...additional settings not printed on the motherboard itself. I can adjust voltage from 1.3-3.5v; multiplier 1.5-5.5x; and processor 66.8-133MHz. So far the only overclock settings I'm able to achieve stability with are:

stock: 95MHz x 5 =475MHz
increase FSB: 100MHz x 5=500MHz (5.26%+)
increase multi: 95MHz x 5.5=523MHz (10%+)

any suggestions?
 02/02/2006 05:36 PM
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Suzueya
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Yeah : Step 1) Download Everest or Sandra or both, and find out what you are getting from your machine in terms of memory read speed, memory write speed, multimedia capabilities, arithmetic processing capabilities etc. Step 2) Go to http://www.k6plus.com (forums - hardware/tech corner - page 1 - topic - "K6-3+ 450ACZ Under / Over Clocking Results") and compare what you are getting on your machine with what I get from mine. - See Post "What is a Superpuppy" on the same page. Step 3) Decide if it it worth the money to get a K6-3+ processor, which apparently your board will support.

NOTE: Your board may require a bios flash to support + series processor recognition, and for some boards that is not available. But since your board supports processor voltages all the way down to 1.3v. I strongly suspect that either it will support + processors as is, or that there is a bios flash available. - That is easy to check at Jan Steunebrink's site.

In the meantime, IF your processor has the 3 Letter designation group "AFX" then you can set the FSB @ 100, the Multiplier @ 5.5 and the Processor Voltage @ 2.3v. THOSE ARE the specs for a 550 AGR, which as near as I can tell is an AFX chip which has been downrated in temperature performance to uprate its speed. Using 2.2v. @ 550 Mhz will result in instability. Anything more than that, i.e. 6x 95 is distinctly risky with the type of processor you have. Talk to Tazwegion over @ K6plus before trying that sort of thing. He sort of specializes in getting the most out of pre plus processors.

How do you get 6x? Well what happens is, if you set the Multiplier @ 2x, later AMD K6-2s & 3s, will remap the 2x as 6x.

EDIT : For those who tried to view the pics of the recent Superpuppy 3 upgrade; who just got blank space, image shack's server is back up now.
 02/04/2006 02:14 AM
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tazwegion
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Hmmm... how fast you wanna' go & how radical can the cooling solution be? /dry.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="<_<" border="0" alt="dry.gif" />

I've managed to push CXT core K62's (non-plus) upto 600Mhz, popping the IHS lowered the temps enough to be stable @ 2.4v with Athlon class heatsinks

While you could push the multiplier up to 2x/6x and gain 600Mhz of 'grunt' (and bragging rights ) it might be easier and still get good results by dropping the multi' back to 4.5x (or 5x in the case of the 533) and raising the fsb to say 112Mhz creating 504Mhz (or 560Mhz in the case of the 533)... the beauty of which 2.2v is still sufficient

Totally agree with disabling on-board IGP... it only taxes your CPU & resources, where a decent 2x/4x AGP (remember the AGP will only run in AGP x2 mode on older boards) say my favourite the Geforce2 MX400 or even a Radeon 7500 would perform admirably & has 'oodles' of drivers available on the net

It's not going to play 'new release' games... but will surf nicely & play older Retro games like Warcraft I & II, Dark Reign I & II, Civilizations, Starcraft, Xwing Vs. Tiefighter, Virtual Rally2, Need 4 Speed SE etc... you get my drift?

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 02/04/2006 10:56 AM
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WarlordOne
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I'm enjoying rehabing this old machine much more than I thought I would...So much so that I'm on it more than my new laptop AND it's drawing me away from my LCD projector project, and Halo2 time...

quote:

Originally posted by: Suzueya In the meantime, IF your processor has the 3 Letter designation group "AFX" then you can set the FSB @ 100, the Multiplier @ 5.5 and the Processor Voltage @ 2.3v. THOSE ARE the specs for a 550...


Good information thanks! My MB is Gigabyte GA-5SMM which seems to be a pretty decent one for being found in a Compaq. I found this great AMD K6-2 article that does a clock benchmark comparison for the AMD K6-2. It made it easier for me to see why sometimes 500MHz(5*100) felt faster than 525(95*5). I've also read elsewhere that increasing the FSB and reducing the multi can create a faster cooler system than just raising the multi and increasing voltage.

Taz, thanks for your input as well, makes me feel like I'm kinda doing things right. I replaced the bubblegum with AS5 and confirmed the "AFX" status of my chip. So far I've run 496MHz(124*4), 500MHz(5*100), 504MHz(112*4.5), 525(95*5), 550(100*5) and oddly enough 496MHz and 504MHz seem to run the programs I use the smoothest. So, right now I'm at 504 and satisfied that this machine will burn through the web as fast as it ever has!

Thanks again!
 02/04/2006 11:31 AM
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Suzueya
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More than welcome for my bit. Did you check out the K6Plusforum to see what I've done w/ mine?
 02/04/2006 10:07 PM
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WarlordOne
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quote:

Originally posted by: Suzueya
More than welcome for my bit. Did you check out the K6Plusforum to see what I've done w/ mine?



Yes I did...and I also checked out the prices for the k6-III+ which is exactly what it made me want to do. They seem to be a little too pricey @$50 for an upgrade. Especially since I can pick up a MB processor combo for under $100. Oh well, I'm pretty happy with where I'm at right now. Maybe in the future I'll pick up an AMD Geode 1.4Ghz socket A processor MB combo. Could make for a fun fanless project but I'm getting ahead of myself...
 02/05/2006 09:04 AM
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Suzueya
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Well, for what it is worth, (according to TA152H Edit : "Who has spent all his working life in the computer field"), the same funny rule applies to + series processors with the following variations.

All K6-(2 or 3) + processors made in the same year, (irrespective of their 3 Letter designation), were designed and manufactured to the same specifications. The difference between a K6-2+ and a K6-3+ made in the same year is that the K6-2+ has half its on die cache disabled. i.e. 128k second level on die cache as opposed to 256k second level on die cache.

Pretty well all of them will do 600 Mhz @ 2.1v, though there are exceptions. Apparently they all come from the same "wafer"; and in grading them into various speeds and heat tolerance capabilities, what AMD did was test some samples taken from different parts of the wafer to determine which were more likely to be better.

They can be had at prices ranging from around $30, (for the lower speed rated K6-2+s - $40 for K6-3+s), on up to upwards of $150.00 for the K6-3+550s; but there is very little difference between them.
 02/05/2006 09:52 AM
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tazwegion
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quote:

Originally posted by: WarlordOne Taz, thanks for your input as well, makes me feel like I'm kinda doing things right. I replaced the bubblegum with AS5 and confirmed the "AFX" status of my chip. So far I've run 496MHz(124*4), 500MHz(5*100), 504MHz(112*4.5), 525(95*5), 550(100*5) and oddly enough 496MHz and 504MHz seem to run the programs I use the smoothest. So, right now I'm at 504 and satisfied that this machine will burn through the web as fast as it ever has!

Thanks again!



You're welcome & I'm glad to hear it's 'tearing up the net' for you now... I note that your motherboard doesn't support AGP, and was curious how the PCI GF2 was holding up with 'altered' bus speeds (upping the fsb alters the AGP/PCI rates too)?

Additionally... if you're going to OC that system permanently you might be curious how other SS7 users have ensured greater stability with (out-of-spec) fsb speeds...like add-on IC coolers (as seen below)



And chipset coolers



Pic's courtesy of Suzueya

More info & pic's @ SS7 Evolution

Not trying to bash Microsoft too much (yeah right! )... but have you ever considered getting Linux to learn with/about (or just plain mess about)? the reason I ask is, IMHO it requires less resources to use 'on-line' ie. doesn't require anti-spy/virus ware, which when running in the backgroud can impede system response (especially older platforms)


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 02/05/2006 06:54 PM
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WarlordOne
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quote:

Originally posted by: tazwegion Not trying to bash Microsoft too much (yeah right! )... but have you ever considered getting Linux to learn with/about (or just plain mess about)? the reason I ask is, IMHO it requires less resources to use 'on-line' ie. doesn't require anti-spy/virus ware, which when running in the backgroud can impede system response (especially older platforms)



I have Debian on my Xbox and I like it fine. I use it to browse the web when I'm in the livingroom and such. I've even got my "Kill Bill (gates)" desktop on it too. Such irony on a Microsoft product.

About the PCI, according to the MB manual the FSB/PCI settings are interrelated as follows:
FSB/PCI
66.8/33.4
75/30
83.3/33.3
95/31.7
97/32.3
100/33.4
112/37.3
124/31
133/33.3

Am I confused or doesn't this mean that a 112MHz FSB PCI is 37.3MHz and AGP would be 2x? I would be better off running the system at 496 (124*4), right? Otherwise she's holding up fine
 02/06/2006 07:24 AM
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tazwegion
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Sweet... I'm using/learning the Ubuntu (Debian based Linux) OS

Looks like the interrelation was geared towards the industry bus standards @ the time... 66Mhz (early x86), 83Mhz (some Cyrix), 97Mhz (AMD variants), 100Mhz (later K62's) & 133Mhz (where the K-series may have gone?)

-------------------------
 03/09/2006 01:21 AM
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FieroGT42
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I don't have time to read the whole thread tonight (it's after midnight) but if it wasn't mentioned here already, FSB can be much more important that raw clock speed. Check this out:
http://www.cpu-central.com/Art...p?ar...79&decor_int=23

QUOTE (WarlordOne @ Feb 4 2006, 09:56 AM)
===========================
Taz, thanks for your input as well, makes me feel like I'm kinda doing things right. I replaced the bubblegum with AS5 and confirmed the "AFX" status of my chip. So far I've run 496MHz(124*4), 500MHz(5*100), 504MHz(112*4.5), 525(95*5), 550(100*5) and oddly enough 496MHz and 504MHz seem to run the programs I use the smoothest. So, right now I'm at 504 and satisfied that this machine will burn through the web as fast as it ever has!

Thanks again!
===========================

^^^
WarlordOne, That's because you have a faster Front-Side Bus!


Anyway, I ran across this topic after overclocking the 533MHz K6-2 to 550 with only a 0.1 degree © increase in operating temp using the stock case and cooling. (I finally re-examined my old Compaq 7470's mobo and found the clocking jumper settings printed on the board, after previously giving up when told that it didn't have such jumpers )

My Base = 5.5 x 97, SiSoft Sandra yielded 1047 mips, 620 mflops
Stepping up to 5.5 x 100MHz yielded 1074 mips, 650 mflops

Overclock that 7470's FSB!

I want more on mine, but FSB settings appear to be limited to 100MHz? I will NOT sacrifice bus speed for raw CPU clocks So the 2.0 stepping is actually 6.0? I read this somewhere else and wanted to verify before I fry anything with my experiments. And can I go 6.0 x 100MHz with the stock cooling system? Is there a jumper setting on the Compaq 7470 motherboard (the "Camaro" setup) that will give me 112MHz FSB?

And finally, here's my contribution to make up for the thread hijack: For anyone else with a 7470 with the "Camaro" motherboard, jumpers 4-8 are right next to the power connector, jumpers 12-15 are where the DIMM slots (RAM) and PCI slots comem close to making a 90 degree angle, and here's what's printed on the "Camaro" mobo:

JP4 JP5 JP6 CPU/Host Ratio <--- This is the stepping multiplier
--------------------------------
On On Off 2.5
Off On Off 3.0
On Off Off 2.0
Off Off Off 1.5/3.5
On On On 4.5
Off On On 5.0
On Off On 4.0
Off Off On 5.5


JP15 JP14 JP13 JP12 CPU <--- This is the Front-Side Bus speed
-----------------------------------------
Off Off Off On 66.8
Off On On Off 95
Off On Off Off 97
Off On On On 100
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