Topic Title: PCIe based SSDs: Are they worth it?
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Created On: 05/02/2013 07:28 PM
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 05/06/2013 07:09 PM
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black_zion
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Yea gotta let prices come down. Most likely I'll just go with a SATA drive. Got Memorial Day coming up in 3 weeks and that's usually a big sales opportunity. I'll be on the lookout for a 256GB Vector at around the 50¢-75¢/GB mark, even though the Vertex 5 drives might be a bit faster, the Vector has been around and reliability is known, plus I know from my drive, at 67% used it can still push out numbers which are about what an AMD chipset can push out. My VertexLE I'll keep as a spare I guess, I paid $350 for it new. I would put it in my laptop, but it's got an 128GB Agility 4 in it.

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AMD FX-8350 w/ Corsair H105, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX Gen3/R2, 8GiB G.SKILL DDR3-2133, XFX HD 7970, 512GB Vertex 4, 256GB Vector, 240GB Agility 3, Creative X-Fi Titanium w/ Creative Gigaworks S750, SeaSonic X750, Corsair C70, HP ZR2440w, Win 7 Ultimate x64
 05/07/2013 01:16 PM
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lezzmeister
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Samsung 830 256GB

Current pci-e ssd's have screwy chips and one too many conversions and adapterchips on the boards. I read all the reviews of pci-e ssd's on tweakers.net and hardware.info, and they all have one kind of bottleneck where there should not be one.

As soon as there is an ssd on pci-express that is worth my time, I am the first one to buy it.

 

Meanwhile, I make due with 2 Samsung 830 in raid0. Read and write are fast enough. Pci-express ssd's have nothing worth ditching them over. See pic for yourself.

 05/08/2013 12:51 AM
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QB the Slayer
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lezzmeister...  I am betting you have windows Write Cache Policy enabled.  Try disabling it.  Enabling it is good for a single drive, but bad for RAID (at least with the AMD SB950)... 

give it a try:

 

As you can see below my crappy 2 x Mushkin Chronos 60GB RAID0 performs much better in the crucial 4k benchmarks

 

 

Basically you want "Read Ahead" and "Write Back" as your cache policies (these should be in your RAID config software)... The windows write cache policy interferes with these.

 

QB



-------------------------

The MONSTER HTPC:

CPU: AMD FX-8350.||.Cooler: Corsair H80i
MB: Gigabyte 990FXA-UD7.||.RAM: 8 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3 2000MHz (7-10-8-27-1T)
Case: CoolerMaster HAF 932.||.PSU: Corsair HX750
GPU:Asus R9 270X DirectCU II TOP.||.Audio: Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Pro w/ Logitech Z-5300e (5.1, 280W-RMS)
System Drive: 2xSamsung 840 Pro 128GB RAID0.||.Working Drive: 2xMushkin Chronos 60GB RAID0

 05/08/2013 11:36 AM
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lezzmeister
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I tried it. But it makes very little difference. Except very low writespeeds, but that is to be expected as there is currently only 40GB free space left, need to uninstall some programs.

I should mention I am running this raid0 on a P67 with i7-2600. Not an AMD southbridge.

I will check with a less filled up disk later.

 05/08/2013 03:00 PM
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QB the Slayer
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I understood you were on Intel.  But those 4k speeds should be a lot better.  Even a full drive should not perform that poorly on the 4k. 

And the 4k is the one that the OS will use the most, poor 4k means a poor performaning OS disk.

 

Side note...  I am writing this using the PartedMagic Live disk (it has Firefox installed)...  this thing is pretty cool. 

I am Secure Erasing my 4 Caviar Black 500GB drives and I am out of Windows for a few hours.  At least I can still browse the Net! 

PartedMagic is by far the easiest way to Secure Erase your SSD's, since it takes less than a second to do each drive.

 

EDIT:  Upon further review, those benchmarks you posted show a drive with only 39GB USED... 

the drive is only 8% full so I am not sure why you said the drive was full

 

QB



-------------------------

The MONSTER HTPC:

CPU: AMD FX-8350.||.Cooler: Corsair H80i
MB: Gigabyte 990FXA-UD7.||.RAM: 8 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3 2000MHz (7-10-8-27-1T)
Case: CoolerMaster HAF 932.||.PSU: Corsair HX750
GPU:Asus R9 270X DirectCU II TOP.||.Audio: Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Pro w/ Logitech Z-5300e (5.1, 280W-RMS)
System Drive: 2xSamsung 840 Pro 128GB RAID0.||.Working Drive: 2xMushkin Chronos 60GB RAID0



Edited: 05/08/2013 at 03:19 PM by QB the Slayer
 05/08/2013 05:19 PM
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lezzmeister
Peon

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The drive is full now. Those benches were when I just installed the system.

Driver versions and everything are still the same, read speeds are at the same level.

 05/09/2013 08:09 PM
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black_zion
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I'll tell you, here's another reason not to buy a MSI laptop: The AS SSD report for it.



When I saw it I thought it had to be a failing drive, so I tried it in my desktop, results were not to far off from my Vertex 4. I know it's SATA II which explains the low sequential read and writes, but the 4K tests and the access time are absolutely abysmal...

-------------------------
AMD FX-8350 w/ Corsair H105, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX Gen3/R2, 8GiB G.SKILL DDR3-2133, XFX HD 7970, 512GB Vertex 4, 256GB Vector, 240GB Agility 3, Creative X-Fi Titanium w/ Creative Gigaworks S750, SeaSonic X750, Corsair C70, HP ZR2440w, Win 7 Ultimate x64
 05/09/2013 11:22 PM
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QB the Slayer
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Indeed!  Wow!

 

Have you gone through everything here:

http://thessdreview.com/ssd-guides/optimization-guides/the-ssd-optimization-guide-ultimate-windows-8-edition/

It is also good for Windows 7 since all the info is basically the same.  The only difference is the Windows 8 Defrag/Optimization program which is very good and one of the reasons

why I really want to migrate to 8.  Anyway this is now my favorite guide/check list.  Some things I do, some things I don't (little to no benefit)...  I suggest people try for themselves

and make their own judgements.  I take guides like these as suggestions.

 

#19 is a huge boost, but pay attention to the warnings.  I have done it on my PC forever, but did not realize that my 4k results were a result of it.  First guide I have seen with this

as an SSD tweak.

 

QB



-------------------------

The MONSTER HTPC:

CPU: AMD FX-8350.||.Cooler: Corsair H80i
MB: Gigabyte 990FXA-UD7.||.RAM: 8 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3 2000MHz (7-10-8-27-1T)
Case: CoolerMaster HAF 932.||.PSU: Corsair HX750
GPU:Asus R9 270X DirectCU II TOP.||.Audio: Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Pro w/ Logitech Z-5300e (5.1, 280W-RMS)
System Drive: 2xSamsung 840 Pro 128GB RAID0.||.Working Drive: 2xMushkin Chronos 60GB RAID0

 05/10/2013 09:30 AM
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black_zion
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#9 is a BAD IDEA and he should get his ass kicked for that. It should be set to "OS Boot Information" as "No GUI Boot" will not show boot time operations, such as disk error checks. But all of those tweaks have been around since SSD's came out, though it didn't help with the first SSD I ever had, the G.SKILL 64GB SSD with the J.Micron controller which over time just slowwwwwwwwwed downnnnnnnnnnn to the point G.SKILL had to replace all the drives for free. Not sure why the access time and 4K performance are so low...I'm tempted to put in my cheapo Vertex Plus R2 and see what it comes up to be.

-------------------------
AMD FX-8350 w/ Corsair H105, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX Gen3/R2, 8GiB G.SKILL DDR3-2133, XFX HD 7970, 512GB Vertex 4, 256GB Vector, 240GB Agility 3, Creative X-Fi Titanium w/ Creative Gigaworks S750, SeaSonic X750, Corsair C70, HP ZR2440w, Win 7 Ultimate x64
 05/10/2013 06:06 PM
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QB the Slayer
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I actually don't do #9 either.  21 seconds or 20.5 seconds...  not much of a boost in boot times and as you said, errors may not be displayed. 

Plus I have always liked the Windows animated logos, LOL!  And yes you are correct, that guide has things that have been around for a

very long time, but it is regularly updated, and very concise.  Plus like I said there is one thing in there I have never seen before (#19).

As a system tweaker I have always done #19, but it was good to see that it is actually an SSD tweak as well.

 

QB



-------------------------

The MONSTER HTPC:

CPU: AMD FX-8350.||.Cooler: Corsair H80i
MB: Gigabyte 990FXA-UD7.||.RAM: 8 GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3 2000MHz (7-10-8-27-1T)
Case: CoolerMaster HAF 932.||.PSU: Corsair HX750
GPU:Asus R9 270X DirectCU II TOP.||.Audio: Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Pro w/ Logitech Z-5300e (5.1, 280W-RMS)
System Drive: 2xSamsung 840 Pro 128GB RAID0.||.Working Drive: 2xMushkin Chronos 60GB RAID0

 05/10/2013 07:15 PM
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black_zion
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Posts: 13066
Joined: 04/17/2008

Went ahead and put my OS over on the Vertex 4



Going to take another image of my laptop's drive and try the VertexLE in it, see if I get better performance.

-------------------------
AMD FX-8350 w/ Corsair H105, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX Gen3/R2, 8GiB G.SKILL DDR3-2133, XFX HD 7970, 512GB Vertex 4, 256GB Vector, 240GB Agility 3, Creative X-Fi Titanium w/ Creative Gigaworks S750, SeaSonic X750, Corsair C70, HP ZR2440w, Win 7 Ultimate x64
AMD Support and Game » General Tech. Chat » PCIe based SSDs: Are they worth it?

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