Topic Title: App Crashes in Windows 8 When AMD Radeon Driver is the Culprit
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Created On: 08/13/2013 10:08 AM
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 08/13/2013 10:08 AM
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deedub
Peon

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Hi thereThis is my first post on these forums - I'm experiencing a frustrating problem on a brand new PC where various Windows 8 apps crash to the start screen. The most problematic apps that crash constantly are: Bing, News and Sport. I haven't had the machine for very long so I haven't checked all the apps. The crash will happen within a minute of clicking on the app, sometimes only a few seconds - it is never an issue of the app not starting. The machine details are:Lenovo ThinkCentre Edge 92ZWindows 8 64 BitIntel i5 3470S  2.90GHZ4GB RAM, 1TB Hard DriveI'm not very techie as you might have guessed so far but I have managed to view the event logsand they state that the faulting module in the crashes is atidxx64.dll. I should have stated at the outset that the machine has an ATI Radeon HD7650A graphics card and th driver version is 8.982.6.0. I don't think it's been updated automatically since I purchased the PC two weeks ago and it would appear to be the latest driver anyway.At the moment I'm spending most of my time in desktop with the Windows 7 type experience but this issue is almost rendering the Windows 8 experience useless. I'd be very grateful if any anybody is able to guide me through this problem. Microsoft passed me onto Lenovo even though it seems to be a software problem and simply wanted to charge me for their premium service. The AMD Radeon driver would appear to be the culprit but as updating is not an option (as it's the latest driver) I have no idea what to do next.Many thanks.
 08/13/2013 10:45 AM
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Eydee
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Originally posted by: deedub Windows 8 experience

Sorry, I had to...

To give useful advice as well, try downgrading. Try different driver versions, try the one on the manufacturer's website, try the generic mobility drivers etc.



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CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 810 @ 3120MHz | RAM: Kingmax 2x2GB DDR2 800 @ 833MHz| MoBo: MSI K9A2 CF v1.0 (BIOS: 1.D)| GPU: Asus HD 6850 1024MB (DirectCu) @ 835/1135MHz | Display: L24FHD | PSU: PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 Quad | OS: MS Windows 3.11 Pro x64

 08/13/2013 11:57 AM
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deedub
Peon

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Thanks for your reply. It's rather frustrating when problems like this occur from day 1 - I never had fundamental problems like this even with Vista. I'll try your recommendations but this does seem to be an issue. Will this be resolved in the next driver update ? I'm shocked that such a basic conflict occurs between the OS and the graphics driver the machine actually shipped with !
 08/13/2013 12:20 PM
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Eydee
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Originally posted by: deedub Will this be resolved in the next driver update ?

I hope you're aware that this is a peer-to-peer forum. Asking this from me or anyone else here is useless, we don't know.

I'll guess the answer for you based on experience: Probably not. Probably not this year either.

Regardless, the first step you should make is using the issue reporting form and reporting the issue. Second step is indeed contacting Lenovo.



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CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 810 @ 3120MHz | RAM: Kingmax 2x2GB DDR2 800 @ 833MHz| MoBo: MSI K9A2 CF v1.0 (BIOS: 1.D)| GPU: Asus HD 6850 1024MB (DirectCu) @ 835/1135MHz | Display: L24FHD | PSU: PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 Quad | OS: MS Windows 3.11 Pro x64

 08/13/2013 02:35 PM
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deedub
Peon

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It was a dumb question borne out of frustration. This may be another dumb question for those of you who are used to this forum but how exactly do I file a report - I can't see a link anywhere on the site. Thanks for your patience.
 08/13/2013 02:51 PM
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stumped
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On the bottom of the driver download page..."issue reporting form".



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 08/23/2013 10:50 AM
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deedub
Peon

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Hi againWell, Lenovo were unable to solve the problem. The driver is the latest one and it would seem that there is a conflict of some kind between the graphics chip / driver and the OS. I wonder if someone could answer the following queries to help nail this down:My graphics chip is the HD 7650A which I believe is designed for all-in-ones. There doesn't seem to be any option to download drivers for this chip or type of chip on the AMD website. Would it be possible to download and install the latest update for the desktop HD 7xxx series or is that a different animal altogether ? Do I have to rely on the PC manufacturer for an update ? Also, I've noticed that the CCC is not functioning properly.It's version 2012.0806.1156.19437 and it is not displaying the full menu of options (gaming etc.). Can I update this without updating the driver ? If so, how ? If I could get into advanced settings then I could switch off the morpholigacl anti-aliaising thing which someone has identified as causing app crashes in Windows 8. I know it's a bit frustrating giving advice to someone like me who isn't very PC literate but I have a new machine here with an OS that cannot function in Metro UI and no one seems to be able to help. Incidentally I did report it to AMD but I haven't even had a reference number yet. ...Many thanks
 08/23/2013 05:22 PM
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Eydee
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Originally posted by: deedub Would it be possible to download and install the latest update for the desktop HD 7xxx series or is that a different animal altogether ?

Download and install -> won't work.

Modding -> maybe, if you're lucky.

Do I have to rely on the PC manufacturer for an update ?

Absolutely. That's how laptops work. (Laptops using nvidia cards as well.)

Also, I've noticed that the CCC is not functioning properly.It's version 2012.0806.1156.19437 and it is not displaying the full menu of options (gaming etc.).

You have a mixture of a driver and CCC from 2 different packages. That's what happens if you use express install and install only "compatible" parts (others are automatically skipped) or let windows update overwrite your drivers. In most cases the latter one happens.

Can I update this without updating the driver ?

You should uninstall all and install a single package which has both the driver and CCC and supports your system.

If so, how ?

If a driver package that supports your laptop and is made for W8 exists, download it from Lenovo's site. Then double-click the exe etc...

If there's no W8 driver, your best bet is installing W7. You won't lose anything except some NSA spies.

If I could get into advanced settings then I could switch off the morpholigacl anti-aliaising thing which someone has identified as causing app crashes in Windows 8.

If you install a package where components are meant to work together, and don't let WU overwrite it, the option will be in CCC. I could post a picture, but it's trivial to find it.

One more important thing:

1. If your laptop came with W8, and there are official W8 drivers for it, which do not work, and Lenovo couldn't solve it, RMA the laptop immediately and get a different brand.

2. If your laptop came with W8 but has no W8 drivers, be patient and wait a few months or RMA it.

3. If your laptop came with W7 or anything else, just stick to it.



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CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 810 @ 3120MHz | RAM: Kingmax 2x2GB DDR2 800 @ 833MHz| MoBo: MSI K9A2 CF v1.0 (BIOS: 1.D)| GPU: Asus HD 6850 1024MB (DirectCu) @ 835/1135MHz | Display: L24FHD | PSU: PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 Quad | OS: MS Windows 3.11 Pro x64

 08/24/2013 06:37 AM
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deedub
Peon

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Thank you very much for your reply - it's very helpful and enables me to understand what's going on a bit better. The surprise for me is that the configuration I have is what came "out of the box". I haven't updated anything. lenovo won't accept that the problem lies with the configuration and keep asking me to do a restore, which doesn't do anything as the problem is with the factory configuration ! I've noticed that other manufacturers have updated their GPU drivers throughout 2013 but Lenovo hasn't done this since The autumn / fall of 2012. This is an all-in-one PC which seems to get a little less support than desktops or laptops so I guess my choice is to pester Lenovo and hope they provide a driver update in due course or return the PC and go for one that is properly supported.....Thanks again for your time and patience.
 08/24/2013 06:39 AM
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Eydee
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Originally posted by: deedub or return the PC and go for one that is properly supported.....Thanks again for your time and patience.

This is exactly what you should do.



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CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 810 @ 3120MHz | RAM: Kingmax 2x2GB DDR2 800 @ 833MHz| MoBo: MSI K9A2 CF v1.0 (BIOS: 1.D)| GPU: Asus HD 6850 1024MB (DirectCu) @ 835/1135MHz | Display: L24FHD | PSU: PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 Quad | OS: MS Windows 3.11 Pro x64

 09/04/2013 03:52 PM
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Marc@AMD
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I apologize for not having seen this thread when it was more current.  Please see this KB Article.

KB-504:
http://support.amd.com/us/kbarticles/Pages/ResolveCrashingMetroApplications.aspx

;Marc



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The information presented in this document is for informational purposes only and may contain technical inaccuracies, omissions and typographical errors. Links to third party sites are for convenience only, and no endorsement is implied.

 09/11/2013 09:06 AM
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stm70
Peon

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Hi MarcLike deedub I also have a Lenovo ThinkCentre Edge 92z all-in-one PC with an AMD 7650A GPU and I'm seeing the same issues and symptoms as he reported and as mentioned in the KB article.In other words Windows 8 Metro style applications crashing soon after starting with atidxx64.dll listed as the faulting module every time at the same fault offset in the module.The problem with trying to follow the KB article's advice is that the version of CCC that we have as part of the driver package installation by Lenovo is that CCC doesn't display the Gaming section even when in Advanced View mode. Instead we only have:PinnedPresetsDesktop ManagementCommon Display TasksMy Digital Flat-PanelsInformationIs there some registry entry we can edit to get our version of CCC to display the Gaming section?When using the 'Check for updates now...' option in CCC it reports it is the latest version.Failing which can you provide the registry entries to edit to disable morphological filtering in the driver?Regards
 09/12/2013 08:37 AM
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Marc@AMD
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I am not aware of any registry tweaks that could be done to get the Gaming/3D section available.  That section is missing likely on account of Lenovo opting to not include it in their version of the Catalyst Suite they provide to their customers.

You can try following the sticky in the How-TO/FAQ category for instructions on a thorough uninstall, followed by installing the latest Catalyst Suite available from AMD's website.  However, keep in mind that you may run into the case whereby you must only use Lenovo's driver.  For example, if you run into install errors, or the CCC software is missing even more functionality, that wil let you know you need to stick with Lenovo's driver.

;Marc



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 09/12/2013 09:17 AM
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stm70
Peon

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Marc thanks for the reply.Can you provide us with the registry value(s) to edit to disable morphological filtering for the driver instead then?I've tried using the standard AMD drivers in the past but they failed to install, and the feedback I got was that for this all-in-one PC with an HD 7650A GPU I had to use Lenovo's driver/CCC package.I see a MLF_NA registry value with a string value of 0 under the following key:HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Class\{4d36e968-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}\0000And a MLF_DEF also a REG_SZ with a value of 0 under the following key:HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Class\{4d36e968-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}\0000\UMDAre these the registry values that enable/disabe morphological filtering?Thanks
 09/13/2013 08:36 AM
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Marc@AMD
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I was able to uncover the following from one of our software engineers.  Registry changes are not something AMD supports, but here it is:

The correct path is:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Class\{4d36e968-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}\0000\UMD\

> You can manually add a new value with "MLF" and 0 to disable it.

Also, if you may have more than 1 graphics adapter, go to:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Class\{4d36e968-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}\

> You will see not just 0000, but also 0001,0002 etc, you'll need to add the key to all of them.



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 09/16/2013 06:16 AM
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stm70
Peon

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Hi

 

I created a new MLF value of type REG_BINARY with a value of 0. I noticed there was a MLF_DEF value of type REG_SZ with a value of "0".

 

However even after creating the MLF value and rebooting I've seen the same crash in atidxx64.dll simply by using the Microsoft news app for a couple of minutes.

 

So maybe our crash (Lenovo AMD HD7650A) isn't related to the morphological filtering option. The crash is very consistent, it's always the same module, atidxx64.dll and always the same exception code (0xc0000005) and always the same fault offset

0x00000000000747db

 

So for this driver version, 8.17.10.451 could you look up what could be causing this crash at this module offset?

 

Faulting application name: wwahost.exe, version: 6.2.9200.16420, time stamp: 0x505a9152

Faulting module name: atidxx64.dll, version: 8.17.10.451, time stamp: 0x501a0655

Exception code: 0xc0000005

Fault offset: 0x00000000000747db

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 09/17/2013 06:43 AM
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deedub
Peon

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And here are details of my latest app crash. As you will see, exactly the same codes.

What's going on here AMD ?

The more information the better as we can then pass it on to Lenovo.

 

Description:

Faulting application name: wwahost.exe, version: 6.2.9200.16420, time stamp: 0x505a9152

Faulting module name: atidxx64.dll, version: 8.17.10.451, time stamp: 0x501a0655

Exception code: 0xc0000005

Fault offset: 0x00000000000747db

Faulting process id: 0x1f84

Faulting application start time: 0x01ceb22cdc9c61e3

Faulting application path: C:\windows\system32\wwahost.exe

Faulting module path: C:\windows\system32\atidxx64.dll

Report Id: 3c95a2a5-1e20-11e3-be77-606c661ff355

Faulting package full name: Microsoft.BingNews_2.0.0.308_x64__8wekyb3d8bbwe

Faulting package-relative application ID: AppexNews

 

 09/17/2013 01:06 PM
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Marc@AMD
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I haven't the resources or the know-how to investigate in detail as you guys are requesting.  I would encourage you to use the issue reporting form to report the issue to the driver development team.  Unfortunately, the form is closed for the current driver.  When the next driver is released, an Issue Report Form will open for it.

Mobility Issue Reporting Form.

;Marc



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The information presented in this document is for informational purposes only and may contain technical inaccuracies, omissions and typographical errors. Links to third party sites are for convenience only, and no endorsement is implied.

 09/17/2013 03:25 PM
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deedub
Peon

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Great. AMD have just referred us to Lenovo even though they are the GPU manufacturer and must have the better technical knowledge regarding the AMD Radeon range. Another dead end. 

Not frustrated with you guys. Just with AMD and Lenovo. It's just too easy to pass the buck....

 

 09/17/2013 05:00 PM
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WMudrockJr
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I use Windows 8 and discrete GPU with no issues. Your system orinally was offered with Windows 7. I don't know if Lenovo has really done there homework on offering Windows 8 on this platform.

If you have the Windows 8 disk you might consider doing a Windows 8 refresh. This would ensure that you have no conflicts. Of course you will have re-install all the software, but you did get a list of what needs to be installed.



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